Meeting on irc.gnome.org:#gtk-devel
Meeting started August 9 2005 16:02 EDT 

In attendence: 

Jonathan Blandford (jrb)
Morten Welinder (gmorten)
Matthias Clasen (mclasen)
Tor Lillqvist (tml)
Kristian Rietveld (kris)
Owen Taylor (owen)
Sebastien Bacher (seb128)
Jody Goldberg (jody)
Federico Mena Quintero (federico)


<gmorten>	tml: do you see the crash from 304702?
<gmorten>	(the assert, not necessarily trigger that exact way.)
<mclasen>	ok, so lets start then
<mclasen>	let me give a quick update on the current state of things
<mclasen>	owen and I discussed the schedule for 2.8 a bit today, and we think it would be good to try
<mclasen>	and get 2.8 releases out around the end of this week
<mclasen>	which should allow us to depend on cairo 0.9.1
<mclasen>	and avoid some library dependency problems with libpixman
<kris>	do we know when cairo 1.0 is going to be released?
<mclasen>	in time for gnome 2.12 according to the plans
<owen>	kris: plan is before the GNOME RC freeze - http://live.gnome.org/ReleasePlanning_2fTwoPointEleven
<kris>	ok
<mclasen>	I don't know if rambokid can land atomic toggle and weak references this week
<mclasen>	but we think it will be ok to land them in 2.8.x, x > 0
<mclasen>	the whole atomic reference counting needs some evaluation from the gstreamer camp anyway, when wim comes back
<tml>	gmorten: no ;-)
<mclasen>	I would like to know if people have any input on release notes/announcement items for 2.8
<mclasen>	my current thinking can be found at 
<mclasen>	 people.redhat.com/mclasen/gtk-2.8.0-announcement.txt
<mclasen>	people.redhat.com/mclasen/gtk-2.8.0-notes.txt
<seb128>	mclasen: is there any bug you have planned to fix before 2.8.0 ?
<tml>	one thing that should be mentioned is that the giochannel code for sockets on win32 has been rewritten, and any non-trivial use cases people have need to be verified that they still work
<kris>	hrm, am i not part of the team anymore?
<mclasen>	seb128: no, I don't have any bugs on the radar right now
<seb128>	k
<mclasen>	tml: ok, thanks. Any other relevant win32-specific changes I missed ?
<seb128>	I'm quite bothered with this icon scale one, but that's probably a GNOME 2.12 rather than a GTK 2.8 ... and since you guys don't have the issue anyway
<kris>	mclasen: maybe the release notes should also mention the note about reusing cell renderers
<mclasen>	seb128: I thought federico reproduced that one, didn't he ?
<mclasen>	kris: good point
<tml>	mclasen: perhaps you could mention that the GdkEventBroken happens much more easily and regularily on windows
<seb128>	mclasen: no clue, owen said on the bug he doesn't get it so somebody else will have to debug, and you said you don't get it neither
<gmorten>	tml: any chance of you proxy debugging the issue with one of the 42 different reporters who haven't been able to themselves?
<mclasen>	seb128: speaking of changes we are still contemplating for 2.8, owen brought up the issue of libXft
<mclasen>	seb128: we're currently linking against it, but are not using it anymore
<seb128>	what about libXft?
<seb128>	oh
<tml>	gmorten: well, the solution is usually simple: don't try to use random odd fonts. and as owen says, that error can really be causd by many widely different things
<owen>	tml: Is it still occuring for random odd fonts?
<owen>	gmortne: DOes gnumeric have a drop down font selector where fonts show up "in themselves"?
<tml>	owen: well, it haven't occured for me in a long time
<gmorten>	I really don't think an assert is appropriate just because we don't like a given font.  Messing up the display, perhaps, but not crash.
<owen>	tml: The issue with the system font being a bitmap font and not supporting bitmap fonts is fixed?
<gmorten>	owen: not yet.
<gmorten>	owen: someone is working on it.
<tml>	ivan wong is working on it, i think?
<owen>	mclasen: vektor just pointed out to me something on #cairo that makes the Xft issue not a ABI issue
<mclasen>	owen: nice
<owen>	(Though conceivably a minor API issue, but I'm much less worried about that, since using Xft but not linking to it is definitely a bug)
<vektor>	crap, here I am missing the meeting again :)
<owen>	$ pkg-config --libs gtk+-2.0
<owen>	-L/opt/rendering/lib -L/opt/rendering//lib -lgtk-x11-2.0 -lgdk-x11-2.0 -latk-1.0 -lgdk_pixbuf-2.0 -lm -lpangoxft-1.0 -lpangocairo-1.0 -lpangox-1.0 -lpangoft2-1.0 -lfreetype -lz -lcairo -lpango-1.0 -lgobject-2.0 -lgmodule-2.0 -lglib-2.0 -lfontconfig -lpixman -lXrender -lpng12 -lX11 -ldl
<tml>	ah yes, i just noticed his recent comment to #307469
<jody>	owen: we do not, it was a performance nightmare
<owen>	jody: Not suprised
<owen>	mclasen: the -lpangox and libpangoxft ther eare actually useful.
<robert.staudinger@gmail.com> is working on a potentially interesting approach
<jody>	that would cache the previews as pixmaps
<jody>	rather than loading every font in existence every time
<jody>	 http://www.abisource.org/~rob/tmp/go-combo-font.tgz
<jody>	I can forward the latest copy if you're interested
<owen>	tml: Of course, I do think we actually should be honoring the system default setting even if it is a bitmap font...
<federico>	I'm going on vacation hopefully tomorrow or the day after
<federico>	for two weeks
<federico>	right now I'm stuck with a gnome-vfs bug for work
<mclasen>	federico: congrats
<owen>	But displaying some other font would be certainly better than nothing
<tml>	owen: you mean "even if it is a truetype font"? yeah, isn't the "system default" supposed to be used only for title bars or something like that?
<mclasen>	(on the vacation, not the gnome-vfs bugs...)
<federico>	so I can't look into seb's bug about large icons, or the libgnomeui/file-chooser crasher
<federico>	mclasen: thanks; we'll move to our new house during that period :)
<owen>	tml: Isn't the default that the ms-windows theme was setting the setting for dialog box text, etc?
<mclasen>	federico: you might be interested to hear that I'll probably end up doing a 2.6.10 release, after all
<mclasen>	federico: to fix some grab breakage I introduced in 2.6.9
<--	GTKool_2kx has quit (Download Gaim: http://gaim.sourceforge.net/)
<tml>	owen: i'm not sure right now. i think at least earlier it used some api that if you read the docs carefully returned a font that is to be used in title bars and common controls menus
<federico>	mclasen: oh, interesting
<owen>	tml: Well, I'll leave it to the people who are more knowledgable :-)
<federico>	mclasen: even after the last 2.6 release, I may commit stuff to that branch occasionally (if bugs come up at work)
<federico>	hmm
<federico>	if during the 2.8 timeframe I find performance hotspots, can the fixes go into 2.8, or should they wait until 2.9?
<tml>	owen: hmm, modules/engines/ms-windows/msw_style.c:get_system_font() uses SystemParametersInfo(SPI_GETNONCLIENTMETRIC) to get varios fonts. the "NONCLIENT" sounds to me like it means windoe decorations and system menu. not something gtk should use
<mclasen>	federico: depends on the kind of fix, I
<mclasen>	would say
<owen>	tml: Hmm, presumably there is some way of getting the current dialog font?
<federico>	mclasen: I'm expecting things like "make resizing faster by having gtklabel not re-measure its layout if it is not insensitive, not ellipsized, etc."
<mclasen>	kris: you're back...
<mclasen>	ok, I have to leave a bit early today
<mclasen>	see you all next week


Meeting ended 16:49 EDT